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I guess it was a fluke that repeated itself, perfect.

Anyways f.. that, there's something else I want to ask you. Why on earth would you be interested in finding out if Maha is accurate? Are you some kind of dyno critic? It's like I'm about to buy a house but first I wanna see for myself if the architect is as good as people say he is, so I run background checks on his technique, rather than just walk around the house see if I like the darn thing and make it mine. Better yet, it's like I'm having a frigid cold Starbucks Frappuccino but before taking my first sip, I wanna see for myself if the blending machine is as good as they claim, so I ask for specs along with a full demonstration of the blending process. I've been trying to understand your way of thinking since your first post and to tell you the truth, you are one of a kind.
Theo,
In the interest of keeping the story as "short" as possible, I did leave out a few steps that DD took in determining the fixed % driveline figure which they used.
They definitely didn't just guess!!:)
if you tell me the vehicle involved, I can probably explain why they were within 3% of correlation with MSR500, in that particular case.
However, IF the Maha is as good as most of the British / European Tuners claim, it is a seriously far better approach, IF what you wish to know is Engine Power.
Of course, if one is happy to simply measure Tyre Power, as the Australian Tuning Industry has for over 50 years at least, then it is completely irrelevant.
A classic oranges / apples comparison.

With your attempt at analysis of my character, you will allow me to be seriously amused I hope? :)
You know your first example, with the Architect / House? If you add Builder, to your example, you are actually Spot On.
You aren't a psychologist by any chance are you?? :)
The coffee example is only an exaggeration because of item value.

I could of course, simply use a DD or Mainline in Tyre Power mode for the work I am about to undertake, as I have done for 50 years.
However, where is the fun in that?
I want to see if this (relatively) new fangled thing is as good as its German manufacturers claim!! :)

I'll leave you with another piece of info on my character.
You know perfectly well what our vehicles cost.
It is basically the same in both countries.

I have searched high and low for a used complete M139 Engine for months.
I have just about given up and am about to spend 10% of the vehicle's original cost on:-
Intercooler
Intake manifold
exhaust manifold
Turbocharger.
For investigative purposes.
Currently, i am debating whether to spend a further 10%, on just the cylinder head, bare. IE no cams, valves or any hardware.
MB Australia, REALLY know how to charge for spares.

You don't know a good European source for MB Parts do you?? :)
 

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So I got my DTUK box fitted today by Litchfield Motors with before and after runs on their Maha dyno.

First, the good news. The car was incredibly strong in stock form, making a corrected 438 BHP versus official stock output of 415 BHP. Torque was measured at 501Nm, bang on with officially quoted 500Nm.

View attachment 8655

And the the not so good news, well at least for me! The DTUK box's performance was distinctly underwhelming. Whilst it made reasonable torque gains in the mid range, peak BHP and peak Torque were well short of the claimed 470 BHP and 594Nm. Max BHP was less than 10 BHP better than stock.

View attachment 8656

I don't yet have a soft copy of the comparison charts so have had to take a pic of the paper copy provided.

View attachment 8657

The car feels like it pulls harder and earlier than before but will try and make some Dragy times in the next few days to see if its real.
@nn7man,
Do you happen to know which gear Litchfield used to make your runs?
Thanks,
 

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2021 AMG A45 S Plus, Sun Yellow, DTUK 470 PS, Akrapovic Evolution in Ti
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So after my to and fro with DTUK around the dyno results, Andrew at DTUK has kindly sent me 2 further maps:

- Map 1 with better signal speed

- Map 1 +3 adjusted to +0, so capable of +4, 5 and 6.

I’m on holiday so yet to try these.
 

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Think it was 4th
Appreciate that thanks.
Just want to be consistent with your test.
Running the POSAIDON box next Tuesday on a Mainline Hub dyno, which will give essentially engine numbers.
Will try to get it on the only Maha MSR500 in the city before the end of next week,
 

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Appreciate that thanks.
Just want to be consistent with your test.
Running the POSAIDON box next Tuesday on a Mainline Hub dyno, which will give essentially engine numbers.
Will try to get it on the only Maha MSR500 in the city before the end of next week,
Will be very interested to see your results. The DTE box costs a lot less for similar claimed results so am going to stick for now.

I have been discussing the full ECU/TCU/CPC + hybrid turbo setup with Herr Hummes but will probably wait a bit and get some more data on my current setup which now includes the Akra back box. Travel to DE might be easier with a gap too.
 

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Will be very interested to see your results. The DTE box costs a lot less for similar claimed results so am going to stick for now.

I have been discussing the full ECU/TCU/CPC + hybrid turbo setup with Herr Hummes but will probably wait a bit and get some more data on my current setup which now includes the Akra back box. Travel to DE might be easier with a gap too.
Were you able to get Herr Hummes to tell you why their Hybrid package is "only" 525 HP and not the 600 HP which is theoretically possible, while maintaining the 600 Nm driveline limit?
 

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Were you able to get Herr Hummes to tell you why their Hybrid package is "only" 525 HP and not the 600 HP which is theoretically possible, while maintaining the 600 Nm driveline limit?
I haven’t got into that with him yet but he did say that they are working on another more powerful package.

What makes you think that 600 PS is possible? Do you have the specs for their hybrid turbo?
 

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I haven’t got into that with him yet but he did say that they are working on another more powerful package.

What makes you think that 600 PS is possible? Do you have the specs for their hybrid turbo?
600 HP at 7,000 RPM is theoretically possible because it is the outcome of 600 Nm Torque.
Which, even with increased and quicker plate apply pressures, is apparently the reliable driveline limit, until we can get those clever Kiwi's who presumably built the gearbox bits for your 1000 HP GTR, to do the same for the W177 A45S.

No, I don't have the specs on POSAIDON's turbo, although I do believe I know the source and if I am correct, just under 550 HP would pull it up.
For either packaging reasons, or simply to make it difficult for the Tuning market, AMG have employed a reverse rotation turbo.
This makes it difficult, although not impossible, to source an increased flow turbine wheel.
I suspect this is where POSAIDON are working, along with their turbo supplier, right now.

However, all the above said, we come back to the practical structural integrity limit of the long block assembly.
Within a couple of months I hope to have FEA completed on the standard connecting rod.
My experience tells me around 550 HP; however I shall wait and see what the science says.

Then one has a really fundamental question, doesn't one?
Con rod replacement inside a highly technical engine that most workshops would not want to undertake.
 

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Was the reverse rotation turbo likely necessitated by the angle of the engine installation.
 

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Not really.
If you pop out to your car, stand at the side and look at the turbo compressor housing, face on.
You will see the the compressor discharge is adjacent to the rear of the cylinder head.
A conventional rotation Turbo would have placed it adjacent to the firewall.
I suppose one could say that doing it the way they did, saved around 5" in the compressor discharge tube ruining forward to the intercooler, which is nice; although hardly critical.
However, one thing about which I am NOT sure, re packaging, is LHD.
It is two years since I last saw a LHD version of our vehicle and I just don't remember the details well enough in that area, sorry,
 

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Apologies, again for not making it clearer.
When I said I wasn't doing anything on my car until Christmas, other than the POSAIDON box, I SHOULD have said any further mods.

Between now and Christmas, (and please keep in mind, we are going to be significantly locked down until well into October, at the earliest) , I intend to concentrate on comprehensive data acquisition of the standard engine, both on the dyno and in the real world.
This is simply because, before I start altering a seriously highly tuned stock engine, I want to know all about the approach taken with the original Engineering.
However, I freely admit, that's me. I like to have a fair idea of the implications of change, before I do them.
You can certainly put that down to an Aged Person's shortcomings, if you like.
.
Or, you could call it for what it REALLY is. A professional Engineering approach.

I am not going to comment further on the Russian post, simply because we are at cross purposes.
I took it as being posted to demonstrate the Power being obtained by the Russians.
ALL my comments regarding vehicle mass were in that context. alone.
You appear to have taken it in a much broader sense, which is you right, of course.
Just differently, so I shall leave it at that.

Sorry, you felt my apology was " backhanded" as it really wasn't.
I need to keep up with technology like the Dragy and should have checked the differences in how it functions as compared to traditional Drag Race timing, before I posted,
Just because you kept emphasizing you're a professional doesn't mean you're one.

Especially when you can't back it with real life facts/data. Carry on.
 

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Just because you kept emphasizing you're a professional doesn't mean you're one.

Especially when you can't back it with real life facts/data. Carry on.
Geez, a little patience please, first data next week, from the POSAIDON, real data a couple of months from now.
I never said I would have it much prior to Christmas.

Just getting the data logging gear together and especially the sensors, is not a five minute exercise in the current world climate,
I also need to then have a professional loom made so that I can easily take it in/out of the vehicle.
28 sensors in total, so its a reasonably significant loom job.

Without wanting to rub it in, at the moment I would appear to be the only one here who actually knows his personal vehicle's real life weight
Which is definitely the second most important piece of data you can know about your own car
 

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Geez, a little patience please, first data next week, from the POSAIDON, real data a couple of months from now.
I never said I would have it much prior to Christmas.

Just getting the data logging gear together and especially the sensors, is not a five minute exercise in the current world climate,
I also need to then have a professional loom made so that I can easily take it in/out of the vehicle.
28 sensors in total, so its a reasonably significant loom job.

Without wanting to rub it in, at the moment I would appear to be the only one here who actually knows his personal vehicle's real life weight
Which is definitely the second most important piece of data you can know about your own car
Rectangle Font Screenshot Computer Parallel

Geez, we all know you're old, but didn't expect you to be THAT old. To get readings from just 28 sensors you have to custom make a loom for it?

I guess companies like VehiCAL would be out of business soon when they can let one have access to over 22000 channels from the CAN bus. I am also using this to get access to the channels inside the CPC as well.

Which sensor may I ask that you need to read from say one today would like to datalog from the CPC? Do you have to custom make a loom for it as well?

Still have to put everyone in the world down just to lift yourself up huh just because you have the weight of your car? :ROFLMAO:

This is getting old, besides the weight do you really have anything else significant to differentiate yourself from everyone else here?
 

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View attachment 8735
Geez, we all know you're old, but didn't expect you to be THAT old. To get readings from just 28 sensors you have to custom make a loom for it?

I guess companies like VehiCAL would be out of business soon when they can let one have access to over 22000 channels from the CAN bus. I am also using this to get access to the channels inside the CPC as well.

Which sensor may I ask that you need to read from say one today would like to datalog from the CPC? Do you have to custom make a loom for it as well?

Still have to put everyone in the world down just to lift yourself up huh just because you have the weight of your car? :ROFLMAO:

This is getting old, besides the weight do you really have anything else significant to differentiate yourself from everyone else here?
At the risk of stating the obvious, for your approach to work, the sensors already need to be where I want them and what I want to see.
The majority of them are not and the couple that are, I want data seperate from the vehicle's existing systems.

Haven't gotten to the CPC yet, that is a completely additional story.

Your ageist comments are really becoming almost as old as I am!
 

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At the risk of stating the obvious, for your approach to work, the sensors already need to be where I want them and what I want to see.
The majority of them are not and the couple that are, I want data seperate from the vehicle's existing systems.

Haven't gotten to the CPC yet, that is a completely additional story.

Your ageist comments are really becoming almost as old as I am!
Or we could summarize it down to you're just too old school and and you're too old to admit it.
 

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Or we could summarize it down to you're just too old school and and you're too old to admit it.
Err no actually not, more than happy to admit that at 72, I am seriously "Old School" !
No problem admitting it and in fact proud of it.

However, that doesn't change the accuracy of my previous post.
For most of what I want, there ARE no sensors in the engine and fairly obviously, no sensors, no read out in your fancy modern software.

I'll just give you one example and no, at this stage I shall not discuss why I want this data.
Happy to post and discuss AFTER I actually have it, which is when I was going to first mention it.
1) Exhaust temperature and pressure at cylinder 3 and 4 exhaust ports.
2) Exhaust temperature and pressure at both turbine inlet ports of the turbocharger.

There are eight channels, just to start.
 

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Err no actually not, more than happy to admit that at 72, I am seriously "Old School" !
No problem admitting it and in fact proud of it.

However, that doesn't change the accuracy of my previous post.
For most of what I want, there ARE no sensors in the engine and fairly obviously, no sensors, no read out in your fancy modern software.

I'll just give you one example and no, at this stage I shall not discuss why I want this data.
Happy to post and discuss AFTER I actually have it, which is when I was going to first mention it.
1) Exhaust temperature and pressure at cylinder 3 and 4 exhaust ports.
2) Exhaust temperature and pressure at both turbine inlet ports of the turbocharger.

There are eight channels, just to start.
You're 72?

Oh my, that makes you the same age as my grandpa! That explains a lot then, well he's just as stubborn as you and extremely proud despite being called upon and proven wrong many times, and he loves putting everyone down just to uplift himself.

I really get it, I do. It isn't easy. He must have the last say every single time or else he just won't quit.

Well this is a free world and anyone can buy any car they want without being judged, though I'd be weird out if my grandpa decides to buy an A45S. Your money, your choice.

Yes, the fancy software doesn't have a readout for exhaust temperature and pressure specifically to cylinder 3 and 4. But it does have exhaust temperature and pressure readout for both turbine inlet and outlet as well.

I understand now, I really do. Please go ahead and continue with what you intend to do with the car and please do share it with us when you're done.

And I promise that I will let you have the last say regardless of what you respond next.
 

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Or we could summarize it down to you're just too old school and and you're too old to admit it.
I appreciate it can be frustrating arguing points but can we please not personalise remarks around age in this case but also gender or race.
 

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I appreciate it can be frustrating arguing points but can we please not personalise remarks around age in this case but also gender or race.
Oh certainly! One could only assume logically roughly the age when someone volunteers the information of himself of having over 50 years of experience!

I'm a firm believer of if you want to dish it, you should also be able to take it.

But since you wanted to bring up the topic about personalized remarks, may I also add in nationality as well? Not that I took offense to it at all when it was brought up first, especially the country flag is meant to appear right next to our profile which defeats the whole purpose of it just like how information was volunteered and not assumed out of thin air.
 
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